Ronald Van Es is a Chief People Officer, most recently at Macaw in the Netherlands, where he spent over 24 years. He started his career in the Finance discipline back in 1995, before moving into Human Resources.

How did you make the move from the Finance space into HR and what led to that?

I’ve worked at Macaw since 1998, where I joined as Manager of Finance and Facilities when it was just a small company of 40 people. For the first two years, I found myself doing all kinds of HR and recruitment stuff, because we wanted to grow and for that we needed to set up the HR function from scratch.

Funnily enough, I really liked that part of my job, because I realized that our people were at the core of the Macaw success. My favourite quote is one from Richard Branson: “Clients don’t come first, employees come first” - if you take care of your employees, they will take care of your clients. At Macaw, this always has been my guiding principle, and that also explains why this combination of Finance and People works.

We were out there to hire the best talent, to invest in them both professionally and personally, and, from a development point of view, invest in their wellbeing to help them become the best version of themselves. If employees feel safe, inspired and well taken care of by their employer, they will transfer that into their work for the customers, and take care of all the customers’ challenges, issues, etc. With that, you create happy, loyal customers that are also happy to pay the bill at the end of the month.

That full circle made Macaw grow into a financially successful company that can reinvest in its people and make the shareholders happy at the same time. I think a company that has such an employer vision is set up to be successful in the long-run. In the end, we decided to split the Finance and People roles, as they became too big to combine, and I was lucky to keep the People role.

What do you perceive to be the biggest challenges for your own role or from a business point of view over the next 12 months?

For the business - and for all businesses – it’s important to set out a steady course that is based on your vision or your purpose, because that enables you to face the volatile and uncertain times that we’re in.

As a business, you need to set that corporate compass, and be very transparent about all the decisions and actions you take, because that will lower the uncertainty for your employees, and will massively increase their engagement and loyalty.

The HR role is not that different. The People side of the business will be crucial for the future, with the scarcity of talent out there in a volatile outside world, and the changing way of work after COVID. Now, more than ever, it’s important to have a clear and transparent People vision, and you need to make sure that people feel safe, feel at home in your company, and feel facilitated to be their best, wherever, however, and whenever they work. I really believe that that’s the only way to attract and retain the best talent in your company.

Is there anything else that you think is changing in the discipline of HR or how it might evolve in the future?

It’s becoming clear to most companies that it is in fact the people that are making our companies successful and, whenever I talk about Human Resources, I really would like to advocate for removing the Resources part.

I believe more and more companies are understanding that our employees are not resources; you cannot be as efficient as possible with them, you cannot squeeze everything out of them between 09:00 and 17:00 without bothering to think about how they leave the office or workday, and if they have energy left for their private life.

I think - and I hope - that we have grown beyond "pay them well and they will work hard", "train them well and they will do a good job", or "instruct them well and they will do exactly what we want them to do".

Employees nowadays are looking for a workplace where they feel aligned and inspired with the company's purpose. They want to feel safe and be able to be their true self, and should have the feeling that their leaders facilitate them in doing their best work, in an environment that’s based on trust and autonomy.

People need to feel cared for in good times, but especially in these hard times. Always put your people first – I believe that care is the employee benefit of the future. Employees themselves really want to care about the company and what the company is about, and - in return - they also want to feel cared for by their employer.

I think that’s the future of HR, and this must be embedded in your company’s DNA, culture, and in your leadership, because this is not something that you can embed or enforce from the sideline by an HR team.

What advice would you give to aspiring leaders in developing their career in leadership roles?

Be a leader, not a manager! There is a big difference between the two of them. As a leader, you explain to people why you do things in the company and what we want to achieve. As a manager, you’re telling people how to do their work and when it’s got to be ready. Why would you hire great, talented people and then tell them what to do?

In being a leader, you need to provide your people with a clear direction, a compass, a vision… And then you trust them to decide on the best way to get the job done. At the same time, as a leader, you should always be there to support and coach whenever they need you. It’s more about guiding and coaching them, rather than managing or telling people what to do.

And the results will be way better, because a good team complements each other; everybody has their strengths and their weaknesses, and if you combine it well, that works magic. The results are not dependent on the person that is either the leader or the manager; it comes from the team. And, if you give them that freedom and that platform of trust, I think that’s the way to lead.

Do you think that skillset of a leader has had to change and evolve, given the hybrid world that we find ourselves in now?

I’m not sure the skills are different for hybrid work, but it’s a different way of having one-on-ones, or having meetings, or trying to bond as a team. I still think that, whenever possible, it’s good to physically meet up with each other.

However, if you’re spread across the world, and that’s not possible, you have to find a creative way around that to make sure that the team feels connected and that you feel connected to the team. That may take more time, effort and energy, but that’s your role. You’re there for the team - they’re not there for you.

From your perspective, what do you do outside of work to help with relaxation and achieving a balance in life?

We had a lot of vitality initiatives within Macaw, and there’s two ways to look at this. There’s this micro level, where you can help people with tips, tricks and education. And there’s a macro level. On the micro level, there’s all kinds of things that you could do to improve your work-life balance, be it on the physical dimension, or mentally or emotionally. I think a lot of these tips are all over the internet.

What I do myself is I try to go out every day just to have a walk after lunch, because otherwise I have this massive after-lunch dip in my focus. That works for me, but doesn’t necessarily work for somebody else; that’s why it’s hard to have these general tips that work for everybody. Funnily enough, I had colleagues that, if they go for a walk, they fall asleep afterwards, so it doesn’t work. Obviously, have a good night’s sleep, try to relax also during your workday, try not to sit too much, and try to change posture every now and then. I think those are things that can help you be more energized.

On a macro level, I think there’s a bigger secret for having a great work-life balance, increasing your energy level and maintaining that on a high level. During a leadership programme, I learned that you can also use Einstein’s formula for energy (E = mc²) for your personal energy.

Think about it. Why is it that people burn out? That usually happens if people have been doing something for too long that doesn’t match what they want to do or what they like to do. Or, it doesn’t match with who you are as a person; it doesn’t match your personality and you cannot be your true self at work. Or, it doesn’t match your capabilities. If you want to maximise your energy, do things that align to your own mission in life. That is the ‘m’ in the formula - it’s what you want. If the goal or purpose of your company aligns with your personal mission, that gives a lot of inspiration and fulfilment.

If you also do things that fit with who you are, your character (the first ‘c’) and personality, you can be your true self at work. If you feel valued for who you are and you don’t have to act out of character, then you feel safe and energetic at work.

And last, if you do things that match what you can do, you can use the full potential of your competences (the second ‘c’).

If you find an employer and a job where your m (what you want) and your two cs (what you are and what you’re capable of) fit, it will bring a tremendous amount of energy and fulfilment to your work life, and also to your private life. If you achieve that, you will probably not have to fix any issues in your work-life balance.

Thinking back to your career so far, is there something that stands out for you as something you’re particularly proud of or something that’s been particularly rewarding?

For me, it’s being able to work on building a great place to work - with Macaw, we were certified as a Great Place to Work in the Netherlands, Germany and Lithuania. For me, that means working in an environment that’s built on trust, and where people feel inspired, safe, and are empowered to thrive both professionally and personally, and basically making it able for them to finish their day fulfilled.

I really believe that if you are in a truly great workplace, people can end their workday with more energy than they started with.

I am very proud that I was the driver of such a culture, where you can see people being their true self and the best version they can be, and also get that feedback from them. That’s the highlight.

Thank you to Ronald for speaking to Katie Insley, Associate Director in our HR recruitment team in the Netherlands.

Views and opinions contained within our Executive Interviews are those of the interviewee and not views shared by EMEA Recruitment.